HVL-F56AM ratio control confusion...

[Greg Beetham]

I did some tests with my F56 using WhyBe's settings and came to the conclusion that using f16 and the wide angle panel is basically a waste of battery power.
I also tried the RATIO setting as well and I couldn't see any advantage with that either. (The user guide says that it is not available in any case even though it appears in the flash menu)
The best exposure was with more 'back to normal' settings, f8 and ISO400 and A mode (F56 left in TTL for my M mode and A mode tests), I can't use M mode and ISO400 on my A100 because it defaults to ISO100 in M mode regardless of what the rear screen says.
The guide book also says that if the flash is in TTL mode and you have a (D) lens fitted ADI will have influence in the exposure.
Greg
ps. I left the shutter speed at 1/60sec, but as David says use the highest sync speed (with rear curtain), you can in the nightclub scene without forcing HSS flash to rear it's ugly head.

[WhyBe]

You won't overexpose! I have just checked f/8 and ISO 400 with TTL Pre-Flash TTL metering and Rear Curtain sync (which is vital for night club shots to avoid odd effects from the ambient light). My settings are 1/160th manual, because this is the fastest speed possible and reduces ghosting from spotlights or disco lights if they accidentally get in the shot; f/8; ISO 400; Pre-Flash TTL though ADI will work better in your situation; wide panel in place; I can shoot right down to about a foot away with either the 42 or the 58, and the 56 is no different. Auto exposure means just that, it will not overexpose.

OK, I will try this tonight. I think the 1/160 will prevent the overexposure because I know from experience at 1/60 it will overexpose. Because the flash is so strong, it typically negates the effect of strobe lights and lasers. I have to do a natural light 1/4 shutter speed shot to capture the FX lighting.

I haven't tried Rear Curtain Sync at any length (never saw any difference when I experimented with it). I'm guessing this will bring in more ambient lighting for the background?

For your situation I would set Wide Area focus to make sure that the camera did not focus between people. If it did this with ADI, the faces would be overexposed. ISO 400 just cuts down the amount of energy used, making recycling between flash exposures faster, and making your batteries do twice as many shots as ISO 200.

OK, I'll use wide area focus too.

[Greg Beetham]

You may have mentioned it WhyBe but I can't recall, over what distance are the majority of your shots? and what focal length do you use..mostly?
Greg

[WhyBe]

Focal length averages from 16 to 26 mm. Eyeballing it, I shoot anywhere from 5 to 15 feet.

[David Kilpatrick]

5 to 15 feet f/8 is only just enough even at ISO 400. Try it. Rear curtain sync does not add anything to ambient light, but it can prevent some ugly effects where lights in the background may occasionally smear across faces - it's less frequent with rear curtain sync.

David

[Greg Beetham]

There seems too be a bit of variation between different lenses on my A100 at least, using A mode f5.6 ISO400 and the KM28-75 it consistantly under exposes by about 1/3-2/3 stop, and using the KM17-35 f2.8-4 (with wide panel at 17mm) it is either spot on or slightly over by about 1/3 stop depending on FL used and subject distance, (close with wide panel tended to overexpose very slightly).
I tried using Wide AF area but found it too unpredictabel as to what it would focus on and which focus point it would select so I settled on spot focus and MultiSegment metering, I also tried Center Weighted and Spot metering but MultiSegment (center spot selected) seemed to give the most consistant and best exposures (on my camera at least).
Greg

[WhyBe]

5 to 15 feet f/8 is only just enough even at ISO 400. Try it. Rear curtain sync does not add anything to ambient light, but it can prevent some ugly effects where lights in the background may occasionally smear across faces - it's less frequent with rear curtain sync.

David

Well, I tried those settings you recommended last night (1/160, F8, ISO400, Wide Focus, Flash TTL) and for the first few pics, it worked!


Then not so good:
Shutter 1/160, F8
Shutter 1/60, F8


Then I moved out to the dance floor area and I immediately started getting dark underexposed images.
Shutter 1/50, F8


Of course, I had to immediately "go for what I know": (1/60, F11, ISO400, Flash TTL, Ratio ON)
Overexposed, I know (under pressure...)
Shutter 1/60, F11


This is better (my typical settings):
Shutter 1/60, F13

As you see, the ratio control IS making a huge difference. The recommended settings just weren't reliable enough for me. I'm wondering if my HVL56 is operating properly?

[David Kilpatrick]

Yes, you only need to get one white blouse in a shot and the TTL/ADI system breaks down - it always tries to avoid overexposure, so with your subjects, a white bit of clothing is going to make the rest of the shot (especially anyone behind the main subjects) look underexposed.

The solution to this is to switch DRO+ on, though it's not as effective with the A350 as it is with the A700 and A900. Also, DRO+ is disabled if you use Manual to set shutter and aperture - it only works in auto modes. It will fix some of the extreme contrast. Also, for these shots, set the camera to PORTRAIT look don't leave it set to standard (or even worse, Landscape or Vivid which are very rough on skin tones).

Another useful tip is to set the camera to NIGHT PORTRAIT mode instead with flash. This needs testing, as it can give some long shutter speeds (don't use it for action on the dance floor, but it's good for groups). This lowers the contrast, switches on portrait tones, switches on DRO+, and balances the existing light with the flash.

However, technically your pix are more correct using 'proper' settings. The ones you prefer are just full power flash, that's obvious. You there by an odd route, but that is what's happening.

David

[Greg Beetham]

Using deep f-stops from reasonbly close range on a group shot that has depth (two people near and another further away), is potentially going to cause harsh lighting on the nearer ones so the system is probably trying too save you from yourself. Those 'dark' shots are not beyond recovery, but not the best for sure, all the 'well lit' shots to my eye are slightly overexposed by various amounts.
Also any white objects as David says is going to throw the TTL (degree of ADI involvement unknown) system off by an unknown amount.
With your particular lens (what lens is it anyway?) it might pay too do some standard flash exposure (ie A mode, ADI set in camera if you are using a (D) lens, 1/125sec or 1/160sec f8 or f5.6 ISO400, do try the segment metering and spot focus) type tests to find out what correction you need to apply routinely, you might find that all you have to do is just apply +1/3 or 2/3 stop flash balance and it's plain sailing from there. (If you get those settings woking properly, and they should, you will save a bundle of battery power even with those great lithium energizers)
Greg

[WhyBe]

@Viceroy
I use the Sony Zeiss SAL1680Z.


The camera mode I shoot in is Portrait with the colors boosted (3) and sharpening taken down a notch (-1) and brightening on 0 (increasing it looks ugly to my eye). Since I sell pictures on the spot (no opportunity to Photoshop), they must "catch the female's eye" when I show them in the a350 viewfinder (guys don't seem to care). So, the slightly overexposed shots actually appeal to clubbers more so than the "correct" ones.

I average about 80 shots per night and I can get 2 to 3 nights out of a set of ultra lithium batteries. If I can make them last longer, I'm definitely going to try. Those damn things are expensive ($16.34/8 at WalMart). I never use DRO because I haven't taken time to actually do comparison shots. Tonight, I'll experiment with other modes 'S'/'A' with DRO on to see what I come up with.

Thanks guys