Kid on a wall...

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DrScottNicol
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Kid on a wall...

Unread postby DrScottNicol » Sun May 22, 2011 2:13 pm

I really like this but I'm in two minds as to whether it should be colour or black and white (and also wonder if I've got the crop / the shadows on the B&W quite right). The RAW image has the kid more centred but I've got a bit of leeway to reposition without the picture getting too small for large prints. The colour image is not particularly heavily processed but (to me anyway) it has a bit of an old film like quality to it. I was just wondering what you guys think? Photo taken using the a55 and Zeiss 16-80, ISO 100, 1/250s, f10, 30mm focal length, processed with DXO optics 6.5. I was also playing with an ultra wide angle lens (Tamron 10-24) that afternoon and whilst I really like the 'get it all in at a funny angle' effect on the Tamron, the lack of sharpness compared to the Zeiss makes me almost wince when I compare them. A case of comparing Apples and Oranges I know but I just love the sharpness and colours with this a55 / Zeiss combo.

Image

Image

Context? Basically, whilst shooting in Rochester, Kent (UK), I saw a couple of kids climbing up a very dangerous, crumbing brick wall (there's a good 30 foot drop on the other side). Obviously, I did what any sensible adult would do.. and took photos of them from a distance :-). I might have mumbled a mild warning but I don't think they heard...

This is what I mean by 'getting it all in at a funny angle with the Tamron - 1/40s, ISO 100, f5, 11mm on the a55 again.
Image

I took a lot of shots in Rochester - the ones I processed are available at the following link
https://picasaweb.google.com/Dr.Scott.Nicol/Rochester?feat=directlink

Scott
Sony NEX 5n (IR Conversion) / Nex 5r / a55 / NEX 6 / Dynax 7 / a77 user

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Birma
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Re: Kid on a wall...

Unread postby Birma » Sun May 22, 2011 6:29 pm

Hi Scott, I think I prefer the colour version as the boy's pink shirt stands out more against the blue sky. I think the figure is a bit lost on the B&W version?

I think most of the cheaper UWAs will appear softer than your CZ. I have the earlier Tamron 11-18, and I find it needs to be well stopped down, and to have some good contrasty light to bring out the best in it. There occassions though when that UWA really makes a shot.
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Dr. Harout
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Re: Kid on a wall...

Unread postby Dr. Harout » Sun May 22, 2011 7:54 pm

Can't say, really, but somehow I'm more prone to the B&W.
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Juanito200
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Re: Kid on a wall...

Unread postby Juanito200 » Sun May 22, 2011 8:24 pm

Hi Scott I think I prefer the color better, because the pink of the shirt lessens the effect of the shadow on the child's back. As to the SWA lens, I have the Sigma 10-20 4-5.6, and it also isn't the sharpest either, but I am so glad to have it for places like that old castle. Mine is almost always at f8 or 11 as well. John
If the last thing you remember hearing is somebody yelling 'CLEAR!!!', assume you've had a problem!!
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DrScottNicol
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Re: Kid on a wall...

Unread postby DrScottNicol » Sun May 22, 2011 9:00 pm

So two to one vote for colour then :-). I know what your saying Birma, its a nice contrast between the pink and blue, whereas in the B&W its harder to bring out the boys shirt without altering the clouds (without going into photoshop and masking the sky off, which I always feel is a bit like cheating :-). I guess I like the timeless quality of the image - the boy could have been sat on the wall in the fifties but both the colour and the BW help evoke that (in my eyes anyway), just in different ways.

And I wasn't knocking the Tamron Ultrawide - It requires more careful composition but I really like the funky angles and even the corner distortions - somehow it just has an 'epic' feel to it, sort of 'Wow, look at all the stuff I can fit into one photo :-)'*. I looked at the current Sigma, Sony and the Tamron in that price range (350-500 GBP) - they all have their pros and cons and based on Dyxum User review scores (not the most accurate measure of quality I know), they are all tightly bunched together**. I tried both the Sigma and Tammy (in different shops, a 100 miles apart unfortunately) and went with the Tamron mainly because it was about a 100 GBP cheaper. If I ever see one in the wild, I'll try out the Samyang which is apparently quite good.

No, the Tamron is nice for what it is.. its just that all my zooms feel a bit soft compared to the CZ now lol.

Scott

*I actually discovered the world of ultrwides via the Nex adaptor - that really is a good value purchase for anyone with the 16mm pancake - for approx 100 GBP you get a solid, heavy, good looking piece of glass that allows surprisingly good pictures at about 12mm (or 18mm equiv) if I recall the specs correctly. And it comes with a snazzy case and built in hood too.

**In fact my major complaint is the lens hood is very wide and awkward to fit into a lens case or back - my solution was to buy an small optech lens sleeve (for the body) and a large optech hood hat (for the hood) - it looks like a giant black mushroom but at least its a bit more protected now.
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Re: Kid on a wall...

Unread postby bakubo » Sun May 22, 2011 10:16 pm

I like them. I hope you don't mind, but I downloaded the color version and did a quick, but different, B&W conversion. Not saying it is better, just different.

Just say so if you don't want people to do stuff to your photos because I certainly understand that some people don't like it. Frankly, I am not sure how I would feel about it either. If you want I can delete it from this post.

DSC04764_DxO_bw.jpg
DSC04764_DxO_bw.jpg (69.84 KiB) Viewed 3234 times


I like your UWA shot too!

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bakubo
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Re: Kid on a wall...

Unread postby bakubo » Sun May 22, 2011 11:31 pm

DrScottNicol wrote:No, the Tamron is nice for what it is.. its just that all my zooms feel a bit soft compared to the CZ now lol.


By the way, how did you focus the Tamron? Bad focus can make the photo "a bit soft" so you need to check that. Many DSLRs, Sony's seem to be particularly prone to it, don't AF wide angle lenses well. Often, even for close subjects the camera will AF to past infinity. With my A700 + Sony 11-18mm I found it almost always better to zone focus or zoom to 18mm, AF, and then zoom back to 11mm (or whatever).

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DrScottNicol
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Re: Kid on a wall...

Unread postby DrScottNicol » Sun May 22, 2011 11:41 pm

bakubo wrote:I like them. I hope you don't mind, but I downloaded the color version and did a quick, but different, B&W conversion. Not saying it is better, just different.

Just say so if you don't want people to do stuff to your photos because I certainly understand that some people don't like it. Frankly, I am not sure how I would feel about it either. If you want I can delete it from this post.

I like your UWA shot too!


Not a problem Bakubo - On my picassa account, I think all the images on my public galleries are downloadable at fill size (with the normal warning re commercial usage etc etc) and I posted here in the helpline forum to see how others would prefer or treat the image. Can I ask roughly what you did? I see the sky is a little darker / his shirt stands out a bit more.

I used DXO's film pack for my conversion - for the record, after processing with the CZ16-80 module for sharpness / noise reduction (there was little at iso 100 but its on by default), I applied the 'slight' HDR function to lighten the shadows a bit without lightening the sky, then applied a conversion to approximate Kodak T-Max 100 (based on flicking through the presets for a contrast looking about right rather than any scientific approach). I then applied a Dark Orange filter to alter the contrast a little and switched OFF the film grain (high ISO B&W film grains can help hide colour sensor noise and are an authentic touch but if it is a clean image like this one, I prefer to leave it that way for pixel peeping purposes :-)).

My 'favourite' ultra wide yesterday didn't actually come out how I'd hoped but I liked the fact that people were pointing at me as I laid down on the floor in the dirt to take the shot - a case of the act of photography being more enjoyable than the actual output lol.

a55, Tamron 10-24, 1/25s, f3.5, 12mm, ISO 100. With the benefit of hindsight I should have set the shot up using the rear screen and then placed the camera on the floor / my backpack*, set a higher aperture and used the timer to make sure I was out of shot when it went off... but where's the fun in that :-)?

Image

*in fact, come to think of it I normally have a gorrilapod and / or a pocket tripod in my backpack which would probably have been perfect in this case lol.
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bakubo
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Re: Kid on a wall...

Unread postby bakubo » Mon May 23, 2011 5:31 am

DrScottNicol wrote:Not a problem Bakubo - On my picassa account, I think all the images on my public galleries are downloadable at fill size (with the normal warning re commercial usage etc etc) and I posted here in the helpline forum to see how others would prefer or treat the image. Can I ask roughly what you did? I see the sky is a little darker / his shirt stands out a bit more.


I just used the PSE 9 B&W conversion tool -- all it is is the channel mixer with monochrome turned on. I played around with the green, red, and blue channel. I only spent about 2 minutes on it.

DrScottNicol wrote:My 'favourite' ultra wide yesterday didn't actually come out how I'd hoped but I liked the fact that people were pointing at me as I laid down on the floor in the dirt to take the shot - a case of the act of photography being more enjoyable than the actual output lol.


Yes, I have done that many times. :)

DrScottNicol wrote:a55, Tamron 10-24, 1/25s, f3.5, 12mm, ISO 100. With the benefit of hindsight I should have set the shot up using the rear screen and then placed the camera on the floor / my backpack*, set a higher aperture and used the timer to make sure I was out of shot when it went off... but where's the fun in that :-)?


Yeah, with the tilt/swivel LCD this would have been a perfect time to use it. With the UWA you would, as you say, have to be careful that you are not in the shot, but you can see if that is the case on the LCD -- assuming the light is not so bright that the LCD is hardly usable, of course.


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