The joys of "Good enough"

[bfitzgerald]

I read the Luminous Landscape article J'Accuse The Enemy of Excellence is "Good Enough".
It wasn't a bad article as such you can read it here...

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/essays/jaccuse.shtml

But on a personal take I found myself strangely embracing the "good enough" approach to starting with a new DSLR system. Despite some AF and hot shoe issues I'm liking the D90 in a way that it's really a very good match for what I wanted. I could bleat out that I think Sony should have done a D90 long ago with their own version, and I think they could have..and unlike the A580 it probably would be enough to hit the spot for OVF fans too.

Interesting to see the new K-30 from Pentax with we hope a cured AF system and sealing and a 100% VF which is great to see some effort here. I've moved on from that and questionable looks aside it should be decent.

Back to good enough. Some folks have this new camera take where they crave the latest sensor and will overlook other areas such as functionality and handling just to get their paws on the latest sensor or roughly translated more pixels. I've never been pixel driven I think the argument for resolution being an issue, has for the most part become a non issue. Today I could have for instance bought a D3200 body only for just under £500. Instead I ordered another D90 body only for a nice bargain of £450. That means the D90 has cost not that much more than the K-x and Km5d did when I got them.

Good enough is a bargain hunters dream. 12mp CMOS is probably for most good enough in terms of high ISO and DR. I really can't say I'm impressed with the constant drive for more resolution 24mp is way overkill for my needs. Indeed I said once the 6mp CCD was mostly good enough for the tasks I have, and in a lot of ways it still is.

Marketing is a curious thing because a lot of buyers will splash out on a D3200 to get their paws on the 24mp sensor. How many actually exploit that is yet to be seen, a minority I would think. The other reason for ignoring the D3200 is the basic stuff that is missing. Suddenly my Metz 58 AF-2 is no use to me for HSS, it can act as a master flash but the onboard unit of the Nikon budget camera cannot. Too many limitations with that body for my uses..not to mention AF motors and other stuff.

One thing I learnt with cameras trying various different ones and makers is that in a lot of ways you can get more then you need. I did toy with getting a D300s, but is it really worth another £550 on top of the D90 to get the better build, same IQ (if not a tad worse), better AF buffer etc. IMO I could not justify that outlay on a body that is a bit out of date. The D90 is out of date but bargain priced out of date!

Of course most buyers will swoon with big pixel numbers and improved video functions, but if that is the path of the camera industry you wonder where they will go next? 24mp APS-C so what next how to impress the buying audience yet another time..in some ways the camera industry is quite sad really constantly looking for updates and improvements to sensors. Sometimes worthwhile, but did anyone hold off on buying a 35mm emulsion because a new one would be on the way in a few years?

Technology may be interesting, but ultimately can prove a distraction longer term. I've spent long enough looking at all this stuff, now maybe I should take some photos
I used to read photo magazines to gain knowledge and yes the odd time gear reviews (right back to film era stuff) now we mostly spend out time looking at sensor scores and studio scenes to pixel peep the latest sensor technology. I suppose I've been as guilty as any on this one, but am I the only one starting to tire of the relentless pursuit of the next technology improvement? I appreciate it's a different ball game v 35mm SLR's you got an SLR and you did not have any IQ debates, it was purely on handling and features/build etc. People used to keep their 35mm SLR's for ages..now a DSLR is almost disposable when the next model comes out.

I intend to thrash the life out of the 2 D90's and whilst observing new models..ignore them for years to come!

[pakodominguez]

I used to read photo magazines to gain knowledge and yes the odd time gear reviews (right back to film era stuff) now we mostly spend out time looking at sensor scores and studio scenes to pixel peep the latest sensor technology. I suppose I've been as guilty as any on this one, but am I the only one starting to tire of the relentless pursuit of the next technology improvement? I appreciate it's a different ball game v 35mm SLR's you got an SLR and you did not have any IQ debates, it was purely on handling and features/build etc. People used to keep their 35mm SLR's for ages..now a DSLR is almost disposable when the next model comes out.

It is not "almost" disposable. It is disposable. Period. When you buy a camera you need to think "how long until I'll need to replace it". In that regard, I think the M7D was fair, but the A700 and the NEX 7 are inexpensive cameras.

I have not read the article yet. I'm not a fan of Luminous Landscape, but I'll read this one.

Regards

[bfitzgerald]

Well fair point to some it might be disposable. I certainly know quite a few people who update their camera every time a new model comes out. Say Canon 550d to 600d etc etc. You can look at it various ways one is that you get some decent cash back for a not that old body, the other is that you might not really find the updates to be that important.

As for A Mount suppose Sony did an A750 in the tail end of 2009 as an update to the A700 with live view and video and a few other bits. If you could buy that older but still decent model right now for a very reasonable price (ie quite a lot lower than it's release price) would you go for it? I bet some would..or we could ask how many are still using the A700 today?

With really old stuff it becomes easier unless you need the shelf space the 5d's I have are worth very little on the s/h market nicely looked after or not. It's simply not worth selling unless you're super cash strapped. With the D90's as they are now so cheap it's hardly worth thinking about selling them in 12-18months time. Next step might be FF for me later on maybe next year.

I could still use the 5d's they are even more dated v the Nikon slower and more clunky no question. But they still work pretty well.
I suppose what I am saying is has the marketing overdrive gone a bit crazy for DSLR's? Or will it simply slow down now..24mp APS-C well not much more to add there. Live view, video now standard..nothing new to see there. Expect 4k years down the road. High res LCD's maybe they can shove a few more in there. It's hard to imagine huge improvements on what we have right now.

[Birma]

I don't think the release cycle for dslrs (or any other consumer products for that matter) will slow down. Economics mean that companies have to sell new products, and that means selling to the existing customer base. Judging from some other threads here, AF still has some way to go. Stabilisation can get better, and the days of the mechancial shutter must be numbered. ISO performance will continue to improve, etc. etc. Then there are the lenses - liquid lenses?

[Greg Beetham]

That’s the question that fascinates me, ‘the need to upgrade’ no one has yet given me any good reason why an APS-C camera in the $1000-$2000 price bracket ‘needs’ 24MP. The most common reason I’ve seen so far is so one can crop, but wouldn’t it make more sense to have less bloat in the memory card and hard disk and more emphasis on composing properly in the first place with a smaller MP camera that doesn’t suck the life out of your battery? You certainly don’t need 24MP to print out snaps for the family album, or 24MP to email a photo of a baby etc. or 24MP for most web photo posting, and you certainly don’t need 24MP for video, Sony acknowledged that anyway because they couldn’t possibly use the entire APS-C sensor at 24MP for video so they cropped it heavily. And you certainly don’t need 24MP at 12 frames per second with a memory buffer that fills up in no time…so all in all I think 24MP on APS-C has been a bit of a mystery too me…so far.
Large MP’s on a properly designed FF camera using the necessary high quality lenses with results and reliability too match make more sense because with the expense of that kind of system one is moving into the money is no object commercial pro grade or very keen enthusiast area.
Thing is though, one couldn’t accuse Sony of seriously trying to compete in that area either, if their model release frequency slowed down any more it would stop altogether, it nearly stopped in the APS-C enthusiast section with no upgrade for the A700 for many years while Canon and Nikon had free reign and I’m still not quite sure that the gimmicky A77 is an actual replacement for that camera anyway.
But on the other hand maybe the A77 is ‘good enough’ for everyone after all, it seems to be quite popular with those who have bought one, so maybe my concept of photography is just old fashioned and I didn’t realize I needed a camera that has video inserted into it when I never asked for it.
Greg

[bfitzgerald]

Greg I don't get this 24mp on APS-C rampage of late, but I suppose it works from a marketing perspective.
I did build a new quad core PC last year so I've no problems chewing through high res raw files either..but what's the point if I have no need for that for what I do. I can't see me needing any more than the good 16mp CMOS which is a nice sensor, 12mp is fine too..and yes even the old 6mp CCD is of use for me.

With the D90 I gained a decent ISO 3200 (which was a bit touch and go on the KM5d) I gained a bigger buffer, more fps (not that important), most of the customisation I wanted, a much nicer viewfinder, more on body controls, and an overall spec that suits me just fine. You have to take into consideration I'm using the old Km's which are a bit dated nowadays..so a D90 is like a turbo charged car in some ways v those one. If I had a more up to date bunch of cameras then it would be less appealing.

But I can't complain about grabbing a bargain, I get a good update on the Km's for almost the same price I paid back in 2006 for the 5d.
As for new models I see Canon are sticking to 18mp for the 650d, they've beefed it up a bit fps and touch screen stuff. I expect a souped up 7d and 60d later on this year too. But the pixel rampage can't carry on, once you get to 24mp it's very difficult to make a case for "need more resolution" at some point the industry will have to settle down into longer release cycles. As for Nikon all the talk is about a new D600 FF bomb which is supposed to be affordable for a FF body

I needed 2 bodies so it makes no sense to get a D7000 or D300s, rather put aside some of the cash save and see what turns up later this year.
As for Sony I'm not sure how their SLT experiment is working out for them. I do think the A700 being left to die was a terrible mistake..and had they updated that model they would be in a much stronger position. SLT was never an option for me, as I said before..Sony don't make OVF models anymore, so if you don't make it I can't buy it!

[bfitzgerald]

Well the fun did not last long!
I've to send the Tamron 17-50mm f2.8 back for front focus issues at the tele end.
Second D90 arrived..the AF is so far off of accurate that it would make a Vivitar with jam smeared on the lens looks impressive. Mounting the 90mm macro it can't hit a barn with a bulldozer! So I've to get onto Nikon with this, and this time I'm in a less than pleasing mood to have one bad body was probably poor luck, to have 2 (serial number even later than the first one I got) is simply a sign that something is very wrong with Nikon's factory output.

I'm sure these D90's were the last ones coming off the line, probably at the time the D7000's were rolling off with AF issues too. Reports of D800 AF problems (really it's a pricey camera) don't inspire a lot of confidence in general right now. I'll report back when I've more information, but I'm really not in the mood to be paying for shipping to Nikon service yet again..I may even consider returning it because it's simply not worth the hassle at this stage.

[Greg Beetham]

I remember reading an article somewhere about how impressive it was that Nikon despite having so much of their infrastructure damaged, some of it destroyed by the various disasters had got back too almost full production in a short time…maybe the urgency of getting product onto shelves had the highest priority, but it does seem most un-Nikon like to be pushing out substandard or poorly assembled cameras without proper quality checking procedures in place. I think that’s as bad or worse even than not having any to sell, but not having any to sell because of not being able to make any is not good only from the manufacturers standpoint, not the consumer standpoint, the urge to give their customers what they are paying for seems to have been downgraded somewhat in the process, and that is surely counterproductive.
The only thing I can come up with as to what they are thinking is it’s better to have something for people too buy in whatever condition it’s in QC wise than nothing and then sort out the problems later, after all those who have ‘bought’ are now most likely on the ‘captive’ list while there will be a small acceptable percentage of losses from those who return the item outright and buy a different brand.
I think I saw somewhere also that some production lines get pats on the back for quantity not quality and that is evident even in the KM5D service manual I have, there is a list of things to be inspected for and fixed when servicing the camera, things that were either damaged during assembly or just plain assembled incorrectly. Some of the main ones were wiring incorrectly routed so they end up stressed and the joints liable to produce capacitance, also data ribbons scraped with sharp edges by careless assembly, or assembly workers inventing ‘shortcuts’ too speed things up.
Greg

[bfitzgerald]

I'm sure you're right Greg I've spoken to Nikon service who say they will refund the cost of postage to the service centre as I've previously had a D90 issue from brand new. My other option is simply to return the camera to the retailer and either get a replacement (I'm not convinced I'd get a good one) or I either get a refund and sit and wait (to see what arrives) or buy something else.

Greg this one is so far off AF wise I don't even think it's hit the calibration bench at all it's much worse than the original D90 I had was and that was clearly off.
It's a shame as the D90 is a great camera overall, using it at the weekend (the one that does actually focus!) it hit the spot nicely.

[Greg Beetham]

Yep all the components have been checked off on the checklist so it’s complete, the QC guys are on a break…so what if a hundred or so extra bodies gets to the packaging section in the meantime, those guys hold up the works anyway with their fiddling and complaints…
But basically it’s just a pain I think Barry to have to return the camera to get the AF components adjusted the way they already should be, it’s not going to be a case that the camera will be a write off or anything but what would bug me is the inconvenience of the whole deal, also you didn’t buy a box full of parts…it was supposed to be a fully functioning camera and on that basis I would have my suspicions aroused about what else there might be they haven’t bothered to adjust properly.
And does Nikon know the full extent that they have a problem or are the people that matter isolated from such mundane matters by the wiz kids and fixers that have created such wonderful productivity...at any cost.
Greg

[bfitzgerald]

Greg if you have D800's with iffy outer AF points (ok not all of them but hey it's a pricey bit of gear) then I can't say I'm shocked that other lesser models have the same issue. Really I have no idea what the problem is, but clearly it's not acceptable.
I contacted Harrison cameras where I bought it from and they are getting Fed-ex to collect the camera, that way I'm not out of pocket paying for postage.
Either I get it fixed ie they send it off to Nikon, I get another one (and hope that is working..of that I would have some doubts), or I simply sit on the cash and get a refund. I'm not really in the mood to get a D300s nice camera but it's a bit old to bother with at it's current price. That's why I targeted the D90 it's enough for me (a working one) and I can then put funds towards something else later on.

It does shake your confidence a bit though I have to say. Although so far Nikon appear to actually have some kind of customer service, as opposed to Pentax who don't

Options and choices. I could just run with one D90 and use the KM bits I have for a back up..and get the money back on that body.

[Greg Beetham]

Yes the D300s option, a classy bit of kit and is one on the ‘good enough’ list I would say, but I think it will take the arrival of the mythical D400 with a rumoured sensor anywhere from 14MP to 24MP (lots of conflicting rumours too take ones pick from) to make the price of the D300s take a nosedive. I haven’t heard if there are any production glitches with that camera or not, in any case didn’t I hear Nikon had ceased production or was that just a rumour.
Were there a few complaints about the D300s overexposing? Or is it my memory that’s playing up as too which model it was.
Greg

[bfitzgerald]

I'm sure the D300s is not in production anymore. There was some talk of overexposure in lower light levels I've not really investigated that much. D90 is fine for exposure the odd time a bit over, can be a tad under in some situations but mostly on target. Surprisingly good for highlight retention the D90's sensor is still very decent, and you can dig in quite deep at low ISO in the shadows.

At the moment a lot of things are up in the air with Nikon no idea on a D400 if it will turn up, a D7100 is on the cards too, talk of a bargain FF D600. It does not seem like a good idea to put down much cash on a Nikon body right now..hence the D90 idea, get another decent body for a modest outlay and I can simply relax and watch what turns up later on. I've no problems with a D300s, but I'm not paying £1000 for one. A nice price cut and maybe I'd take a look. Ideal solution is a working D90 Or course I could try a D7000 and hope that works.

[bfitzgerald]

Quick update I sent the Tamron 17-50mm f2.8 back to the supplier and they replaced it (fairly quickly I would add) and it's much better than the first one I had.
The original D90 appears to be front focussing a bit (with all lenses) the new Tamron is better partly because I suspect the first one was misaligned at the tele end because it was doing major FF (allowing for some FF on the body) thus making tele shots "soft" or rather just too far off focus. Double combination of FF made it worse than a kit lens sharpness wise.

So "it's not over yet" D90 body 2 is with the shop and I've asked them to send it off to Nikon for service. I don't expect to see that for a while (weeks) in total.
D90 first one will have to go back to service, the FF isn't big..but it's off enough to put the faster lenses off a bit too much. I'm not over joyed at the prospect of having to wait for one to come back, before I can send the other one off!

I might write a letter to Nikon explaining that I'm not overly happy about buying 2 D90's that need to be sent to service to make them usable, nor with having to send the first one in again for service because they over adjusted it a bit too much. Seems my cameras spend most of their time not being used because they're sent off for service! This stuff should just work out of the box. If and when I get a reply I will update things. I think this is the right way to tackle this one because it's really not acceptable (even if the second one comes back perfect) I've also racked up quite a few thousand shots on the first D90 torturing myself with AF tests. I don't mind as I have a 2 year warranty...but all the hassle involved just isn't good for any customer.

[UrsaMajor]

On this general subject, Ctein has an interesting - if unsurprising - article on The Online Photographer today (20 June).

The link to it is:

http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.co ... art-i.html

With best wishes,
- Tom -