hi david thank you for clearing that up for me, it was bugging me a bit.
by the way whatsyour take on camera clubs, i joind a local club full of old boys (to be honest they are the same age as me) but they seem so dogmatic always having disagreements. i am thinking of leaving it the online clubs like this seem so more helpfull.
i also noticiced the local club members taking shots just to please certain judges, instead of themselve. i woulf love to have a annual club meet with photoclub members, i think i would remain a member of photoclubalpha even if i changed to nikon or canon.