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 Post subject: NEX7 EVF et al
Unread postPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:08 am 
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David’s recent review of the a99, my limited hands on with it and my experience with a friend’s NEX7 has left me perplexed with these top of the line Sony EVFs in modest room level light. The EVF irritatingly pixelates or granulates tremendously. In the same lighting another friend’s Olympus OM-D is wonderful. On the surface, I can chalk it up to different technologies but that really doesn’t make sense to me. In daylight the NEX 7 EVF is beautiful. But in lower room lighting it becomes less than stellar. Since the image is coming off the sensor and the image the NEX7 produces in that lighting is elegant and certainly (essentially) noise free… especially when viewed at the resolution in the EV….why isn’t the EVF in the same low light ‘noise’ free?.

I do know that some picture viewers on my computer use algorithms that when they down res images look vaguely similar in granularity especially if there is noise present. So is this a result of poor down sampling algorithms that don’t handle any noise well?

Or is it a hardware issue, and if so, where in the pipeline is the actual problem? I have a hard time believing it’s the EVF itself (which is what everyone blames) because it only displays what it is fed. I have to be missing something obvious.

Bruce


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 Post subject: Re: NEX7 EVF et al
Unread postPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:10 pm 
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I’ve gotten an answer of sorts…at least indirectly.

It seems there is no problem with the Nex 7 EVF (and by extension the a99) and it has a perfect viewfinder, even when in dimmer lighting. No one can explain why the EVF granulates in poor light because apparently it doesn’t.

Or at least that’s how I would interpret the results of an informal poll over on the NEX forum at Dpreview about what is needed in the next iteration of the NEX7 (NEX 7m?) Not one person asked for this to be addressed…or anything about the EVF for that matter. It must be perfect and I’m making this up or perhaps hallucinating.

Actually, I’m more confused now than ever.

Bruce


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 Post subject: Re: NEX7 EVF et al
Unread postPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:25 pm 
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sometimes you get the runt of the litter, have it checked out or ask someone to let you view through theirs for comparison


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 Post subject: Re: NEX7 EVF et al
Unread postPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:26 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 11:20 pm
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When I first read Bruce Oudekerk's initial post about the NEX-7 EVF
Quote:
The EVF irritatingly pixelates or granulates tremendously.
I immediately grabbed my new NEX-6 in my fairly dimly lit "office" with dark corners. I could not discern any pixelation even in the dark corners. I resolved not to post as somebody with better knowledge than me surely would voice and opinion. Just turned the light off and did a swerve with my RX100 and here again I didn't notice any pixelation. On the other hand there may be some mild "granulation" effect in the darker areas, but I would suspect that as being inevitable considering the circumstances. Not too different from watching through professional night vision equipment. The ability to turn dark into visible in itself is tremendeous and where EVF scores over OVF.


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 Post subject: Re: NEX7 EVF et al
Unread postPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:28 pm 
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OK - first, the doptre correction setting on the EVFs needs absolute precision. If you can't see pixels on the finder array, you either don't have good enough eyesight, or you have the dioptre set not quite perfectly enough. You should be able to see pixels clearly on your laptop or computer screen from normal working distance, even if you are using a Mac Retina iPad. The pixels on the EVF are relatively coarse compared with this. That's one issue.

Secondly, whatever JPEG setting you use, your EVF will display according to that. If you turn sharpness up, you'll get a sharpened EVF view. That also affects how well (or how discriminatingly) focus peaking works.

Thirdly, the A77 and NEX-7 both have a load of coloured noise in low light, through the EVF. The sensors use auto gain if you want it in manual mode (studio) but normally reflect how the shot looks. If the ISO goes over 1600 on Auto ISO, you get bad noise in low light on the EVF. But when it really gets bad is when you use flash. This turns on auto gain (like the setting for manual studio work) and over-rides the finder showing the actual image exposure effect. It also over-ride ISO limits, so the cameras will range up to an effective 12800 ISO for viewfinder purposes. With flash, the shutter speed is set to 1/60th or 1/160th but always to 1/60th in low light. That may not be enough if your lens is at f/11 for flash, to even show an image. So the camera turns up the EVF gain enormously.

Result - terrible viewing conditions for anyone shooting flash, in low light, at smaller apertures.

The A99 with its much larger sensor pixels and better high ISO noise, and even the A55 with its low contrast EVF and 16 megapixel sensor, both provide far superior dark/low light viewing with flash and significantly better with slow shutter speeds and normal picture effect.

David

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 Post subject: Re: NEX7 EVF et al
Unread postPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 9:20 pm 
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This makes perfect sense, David, and explains the discrepancies in my experience from many others. And my experience is limited to a modest number of times handling a friend’s NEX7.

Thanks everyone.

Bruce


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