A99 Marathon work-out

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bfitzgerald
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A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by bfitzgerald »

I finally got around to testing the A99 for a marathon, a real world use
Overall results were better than expected. Despite lacking the snazzy AF modes of the A77ii, it quickly became clear this is the go to camera for such events. I rarely use 6fps, instead time bursts at cont low mode, perhaps 5-6 at a go sometimes less
I use the group AF, of course I wish the coverage was wider - still perfectly usable. Group AF helps as some runners have reflective tops, , though single point can work it's hard to judge using the EVF as you're never quite sure where they are next!

I elected to travel light (it was a long day 100K run) and used lenses I didn't expect to perform well - and didn't skip a beat it was bang on 95% of the time
With this latest shooting experience, I'm quickly losing interest in APS-C, very quickly!

100-200mm F4.5
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I previously said the 100mm F2.8 macro sucks for AF tracking, I was wrong on the A99 it nailed almost every shot. Just make sure to put the limiter on
It's a much lighter alternative to the heavy 80-200mm
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Despite it's age/drawbacks I'm warming up to the A99 quite a bit since this shoot
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bfitzgerald
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by bfitzgerald »

I did use the beercan for some, but for some reason I found myself sticking more to the 100-200mm
Here at F4
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I also have to be honest I wasn't that impressed with the A77ii AF performance
I tried multiple settings AF/balanced emphasis, track duration, zone/expanded flexible etc. Keeper rate was quite a lot less than the A99
And some of the shots were easy ones too (ie not moving much). I'm glad the A99 was the primary shooter on this, goes to show that having a fancy AF array doesn't always mean results are better.
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bfitzgerald
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

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Here are some of the problem A77ii shots, despite trying various settings you get a lot of misses
Fortunately I didn't use it much as wouldn't have wanted too I'd have to increase my shots hugely to try to get keepers

This is using the 18-135mm SAM which previously on the A57 was working like a champ (mostly good hit rate). There is no obvious front/back focus issues with this
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bfitzgerald
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

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Second sequence. True this was one of the worst I saw, still I had more duds with the A77 in a couple of sequences then I did off the A99 which really cause me no problems for AF it just keeps hitting on target or very close. There are a few big misses too
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sury
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by sury »

Very interesting study Barry. I loved the A99 shots. What do you think of the FF's impact on your shooting technique(s)?

Sury
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bfitzgerald
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

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sury wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 5:01 pm Very interesting study Barry. I loved the A99 shots. What do you think of the FF's impact on your shooting technique(s)?

Sury
I don't think it makes much difference, but I do notice the image quality improvements more latitude in raw and I just like the look better. Truth is very little adjustments needed; WB is usually on target and exposure also consistent, I add a little at times. You do of course get shallower depth of field if that's important.
I didn't run the buffer once, partly because I wasn't gunning it like crazy - I tried that before and you make an awful lot of work for yourself sorting through images. 6fps is enough for this type of shooting and many other activities

Perhaps APS-C is a stepping stone to me, I've just lost interest in it. Maybe another time I'll try the LAEA4 adapter and see how that works :mrgreen:
There is nothing wrong with the A99 AF, apart from limited coverage it's accuracy is at least on this one very good. AF-D can stop it wandering if you move the AF array out of the subject with only 2 lenses I have though didn't feel it made much difference, I can see how the new MILC can help with composition and big point coverage. With 24mp to play with I don't see an issue with it.
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by ValeryD »

Well, about optics, a99 camera is serious, professional, should work accordingly well with most lenses. Once I had both the a77-2 and a99, the a77-2 has a faster and better AF than the a99, the quality of pictures, especially in low light, is the same, both cameras are 24MP. Another thing is how to use the AF correctly on the a77-2. Of course, this is just my opinion, which developed after several years of working with a77-2 and a99-2, and I only had a99 for a week, but the new camera did not suit me with the quality-price ratio. Although the camera itself is very much made.
Well, the pictures from the marathon turned out to be very good!
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bfitzgerald
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

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I can only go on 2 days shooting with both and the A99 just outclassed the A77ii. There is nothing wrong with the sensor on the crop camera, it's improved over the A77, a bit - though IMO the A99 is still better in low light and dynamic range.
Thing is despite playing with the AF settings on the A77ii, I was expecting better it hesitated in some situations and had more clearly OOF shots, than I'm used to seeing. Even the Dynax 5d would have nailed some of those, let alone a much newer camera. A57 didn't have many issues it certainly didn't have big misses, nor does the A77. My experience is fairly close to this report on IR
https://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/ ... art-ii.htm

No idea what the issue is but I wouldn't take the A77ii out over the A99 for cont AF performance, the 99 delivered IMO for whatever reason.
As a new purchase no it was seriously overpriced, as a used one it can be a bargain if you need the full frame part of it. AF hit rate is near to 5-6 on the A77ii, and 8-9 odd on the A99, that's based on field use. I can deal with slight misses if it's small no AF is perfect - a big miss means the image isn't usable. That's a problem
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sury
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by sury »

I do not have A99. I jumped to A99M2 straight from A900. I enjoy the 12fps and the 42MPx on M2.
On my recent trip to Seattle, WA, USA, I chose to shoot bracketed shots due to unseasonably cool/cold
cloudy, rainy and gloomy weather with occasional clearing of the sky. I certainly over did with 9 image bracketing,
where a 3 image bracketing would have been suffice, but consequently, as you rightly pointed out Barry, I ended up
with 3300+ images. :roll: I actually filled on 64GB card and had to switch to slot 2. :lol: Those images will be posted
soon. 8)
I was using A99M2 with Sigma 1735 most of the time and few I tried with Minolta 80-200f2.8

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bfitzgerald
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by bfitzgerald »

It's easy to do run and gun and lot of sorting images too. The A77ii IMO works better single point, the expanded flexible spot/group didn't work that well for me so I will stick to the A99 - I think DPR pointed that out with their article
https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/sony-a ... t-a77ii/11

Agree with that based on trying the expanded/group settings it's just hit and miss. You're better off using single point. Not sure on the A99ii as it's newer I would have hoped they would have improved it. Either way I think the A77ii is going to be put out to pasture

I was tempted to try an older A900 - but at this stage perhaps it's a bit too old hat who knows I am offloading APS-C stuff options down the road I suppose. A99ii still commands high prices so for me the A99 seems to be the best bang per buck (for what I use it for)
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ValeryD
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by ValeryD »

Everything is correct on camera a99. There is no topic for dispute. :)
As for the autofocus a77-2, the first is the lenses that you use on the crop, should still be for the crop and Sony.
I did a long time ago a test in a store buying SAL1680z, so this is what happened:
1 SAL1680 - not a single miss out of three shots (actually out of 9), everything is accurate and in focus !
2 SAL1650 - out of 3 shots - one miss
3 SAL18135 - 3 shots - two misses hiccup!
It would be possible to further discuss this topic, the specifics of settings for specific lenses, but I no longer have this camera, I do not really remember all the settings for the a77-2.
I recommend looking at Sony's own extended manual of the AF a77-2, and gary friedman wrote well the features of using the AF on the a77-2.
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bfitzgerald
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by bfitzgerald »

I tried many settings result is I'm just not happy with the performance, it's just not working out even on simple stuff it's missing too often.
I've not seen this on the A77, A57, or even the LAEA4 adapter not to this degree. Off shots happen, but some of them are easy ones. I find the expanded and group AF not reliable enough even with tweaking. The single point is better, but I'm not seeing "end result better" v the other cameras

Just getting too many of these, ie nothing in focus. It really struggled at the start of the race in lower light - big time. If you put it on AF priority even then I had missed shots higher than I would expect, and pretty easy ones too. I can use single point but it's not ideal for runners, if you're point drifts it could hit a high vis area on their shirts and bingo you have focus racking. That's why my first attempt with the 100mm F2.8 sucked, because I wasn't using group AF, when you do the problems disappear - so bottom line is despite lots of AF points the A99 is hitting the target way better. It's not even close.

Stuff like this is pretty odd, nothing in focus at all
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I can't afford to safety shot stuff with 4-5 shots to hope one is in focus. So the A77ii is now going out to pasture sadly. It's first real test and it didn't do very well IMO
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by ValeryD »

It's back focus between people on the window, plus micro movement of the camera in the hands.
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bfitzgerald
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by bfitzgerald »

Micro movement? It's a flash shot not a long exposure
Nothing on that image is in focus, at all not the background/foreground if the background was in focus I'd agree. It doesn't do that often but more than I would like, and I've also seen it yes focus on the background sometimes. I'm getting the vibe just like the IR/DPR articles in that the larger AF zones are not very consistent. Even on the DPR test it showed big variation on static subjects. Single point AF is better, still I'm disappointed with it's performance

At the race start it took 3 seconds to AF when set to AF priority, it wasn't that hard to find focus IMO. Some quirky things going on with the A77ii
It's also a Sony lens, whilst the 18-135mm isn't that fast I dread to think what would happen with longer/faster lenses. There is always an AF variation with any camera, I've seen people testing in depth - but it's usually fairly narrow variation. The DRP page showed very similar results some in focus, some off quite a bit and a few way off. Strange, the IR field test gave a similar results he complained at times it focussed in the background despite the AF points being on other targets.
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Re: A99 Marathon work-out

Unread post by ValeryD »

Maybe you got a bad copy of a77-2 camera?
Seriously, I got used this camera for more then 6 years. :D No complains at all! Ton of sport shots done by a77-2. It was my favorite camera after a99-2. :shock:
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