Photoclubalpha

Had a chance to try some more shooting today:

http://www.dphotoexpert.com/2009/05/06/ ... -300mm-vr/

Although I think I might not make much use video if Sony bring it in, the more I experiment with video-SLR the more I like it - despite the obvious problems.
A big factor in this is Apple's iMovie 09. This program enables me to create a short video like this in about the same time it takes to stitch a few pix for a panorama (the process is rather similar). Including saving the still photos into my iPhoto library (never previously used), about 15 mins to edit, add fx, titles and the stills.

David

I think it is the same reaction lots of people in forums have: I don't need video on my Dsrl (you call denial?) but, if you have it, it is sooooo nice! I hope we'll see Sony bringin us video-Dsrl soon: I'll love doing montion on APS or FF with my Minolta glases.

Regards

PS: I read in the Minolta @ Yahoo groups forum that sensors for video are less good than sensors for stils, so bringing video to an A900, by example, will only reduce image quality. there might be a way to fix this since 5D Mark II is an excellent camera, image quality wise (there are other things that I don't like about Canon, but Image quality isn't in that list)

first time i've seen the wiggly lines om such far away shots. the railing right by the horses at the start of the scene seems flexible but it all seems to get better when the horses are in front of you. Can you not hook an external mike to the camera? the sound is horendous, how is it with just a light breeze?

In windows you can get moviemaker free and it works well for assembling videos and small edits and things

You can't plug an external mic into the D500, 5000D or D90. Only into the Canon 5D MkII. I'm beginning to realise that this is a serious issue, a light breeze may or may not cause problems - it depends on the way it hits the camera. The rolling shutter effect on this clip is actually not bad, it has worked fairly well compared to some action or panned views.

David

The sample looked pretty good to me. But the baffle thing shows that the video aspect is not really being looked at with great care on the SLR's. Video appears right now as a tack on feature. I probably would play about with it, but still, I think it's a distraction from making improvements to a stills camera.

I don't expect video to turn up on sony alpha's any time soon, in fact we would be lucky sensor based live view.

I won't disagree with sony's thinking in not doing video, though there is some use for live view on the non dedicated LV models, I think sony should re-consider that side of things

I would like too know a little more about the implementation side of things, what exactly happens with the lens diaphragm? if you shoot at say f8 does it stop down too that for the duration of the video? it obviously isn't capable of flicking down and back for each frame so I guess it stays there, so what happens then too LV/EVF at f8 does it brighten up to compensate and become grainy or darken and become difficult to see?
Greg

ps. Something else just occurred to me, what if you are using the cam in a dark place? obviously you would need some sort of illumination, but what's available for a DSLR movie cam?...and if there is something available that probably means carrying around two sorts of illumination, flash for stills and a movie light for when you switch to video, and what about the power supply for the light?

bfitzgerald wrote:The sample looked pretty good to me. But the baffle thing shows that the video aspect is not really being looked at with great care on the SLR's. Video appears right now as a tack on feature. I probably would play about with it, but still, I think it's a distraction from making improvements to a stills camera.

Exactly! Don't waste the time with a toy and spend the R&D on better cameras.

Greg Beetham wrote:I would like too know a little more about the implementation side of things, what exactly happens with the lens diaphragm? if you shoot at say f8 does it stop down too that for the duration of the video? it obviously isn't capable of flicking down and back for each frame so I guess it stays there, so what happens then too LV/EVF at f8 does it brighten up to compensate and become grainy or darken and become difficult to see?
Greg

ps. Something else just occurred to me, what if you are using the cam in a dark place? obviously you would need some sort of illumination, but what's available for a DSLR movie cam?...and if there is something available that probably means carrying around two sorts of illumination, flash for stills and a movie light for when you switch to video, and what about the power supply for the light?

Too many compromises trying to get everything into one. I want a stills camera. When I want to shoot video I get out my video camera. I'll bet the surveys they did showed that very few serious shooters want video integrated into the Alpha line.

Dusty

I'll bet they put more stock in wild surveys than they do in surveys of people that are already using some product .. theirs or not. If us, the Old minolta people and early adopters, don't recognize that these manufacturers are courting new users. then we are going to continually be dissapointed in their new products. No ofense intended for Barry but he epotomizes a lot of attitude of the dyed in the wool current DSLR users and he still prefers film. Sony or nobody can run a business if those are the users that are supporting your efforts, so his yours and my opinions don't carry much weight as far as small annoyances like this or the lack of MLU or the colour of a lens. Versus their market research that are saying "man I'd really like my new camera to be able to do video and Stills ... what the heck is MLU anyway.. and I don't see rolling shutter (wtf is that) all I see are pretty horses..."

Dusty wrote:
Too many compromises trying to get everything into one. I want a stills camera. When I want to shoot video I get out my video camera. I'll bet the surveys they did showed that very few serious shooters want video integrated into the Alpha line.

Dusty

David Kilpatrick wrote:You can't plug an external mic into the D500, 5000D or D90. Only into the Canon 5D MkII.
David

The new Pentax K7 will have an external mic contact!
If sony brings video it demands SSM lenses at least. The fact that the new 18-55 kit lens comes with some kind of motor (ring type possibly) may point at a built-in video option of the lower end cams to come. I'm not sure about the A700-sucessor however. They might choose for a low line series (330 series) with video, a high-end APS-C as an A700 successor without it, and one with video with mixed specs. But I think all will get live view and it would be wiseto fit in articulated lcd's to go with it.

lock

Camcorders have built in focus motos I dont see SSM being an issue for noise unless an older minolta lens is used ... they are noisey, but in the end if there no external mic the sound is going to be just like Nikon's is. Is the sound of a little motor that big a deal in the calliope of noise from wind, breath, fingers sliding on the body, zooming and everything else thats picked up?

Well hang on a moment Javelin. I do use film "for some stuff" I do use digital too. No problems if folks want to call me more traditional, I am!
But consider this, most folks I meet outside of the dp forums (yeah the real world) are not gagging for video..not at all, neither are they desperate for micro DSLR's either.

All very well adding this new video stuff, but after a while, everyone will do it..then no maker has anything to offer over their rivals, what then??

Mirror lock up was a pretty good example of a genuine and useful feature for photographers, needlessly ripped out to please some nerd at Sony HQ. I think I raised a valid point on that one. But there was I complaining about that, and what happens? Sony decide to kill the good handgrip! So the MLU campaign now becomes the "save the handgrip" one

It's not my fault Mark Weir is not doing a good job!

bfitzgerald wrote:Well hang on a moment Javelin. I do use film "for some stuff" I do use digital too. No problems if folks want to call me more traditional, I am!
But consider this, most folks I meet outside of the dp forums (yeah the real world) are not gagging for video..not at all, neither are they desperate for micro DSLR's either.

All very well adding this new video stuff, but after a while, everyone will do it..then no maker has anything to offer over their rivals, what then??

Mirror lock up was a pretty good example of a genuine and useful feature for photographers, needlessly ripped out to please some nerd at Sony HQ. I think I raised a valid point on that one. But there was I complaining about that, and what happens? Sony decide to kill the good handgrip! So the MLU campaign now becomes the "save the handgrip" one

It's not my fault Mark Weir is not doing a good job!

By "micro DSRL's" you mean cameras in the category of the Panasonic G1? because your A200 isn't really a big camera...

I won't defend Ms Weir work, but "Mark Weir" is just a name. I mean, I don't think he decide anything at Sony, even if he might have a "voice" at the Sony DSRL headquarters. I had the chance to speak with some people at KonikaMinolta years ago and the impression I had is that Japanese companies take their decisions without giving that much importance to what "branches" think about -we expect they will take special care to the North American and or European market because we think they sell more cameras here, but I think they pay much more attention at what's happening in Asia, and specially now that people in China start having enough money for buy this kind of equipment.

I spoke, by chance. with Mark Weir at the Photo Plus Expo last year. I found he was in a difficult position because he knew the weakest points of the Alpha cameras, specially the A900 -He was defending some decisions engineers and designers made in Japan for the A900, talking about in a distant way, like: "the designer's team decided this was the appropriated way..." I think he's doing his job, but some people have a different point of view, I hope we will see soon the results.

Regards

pakodominguez wrote: I won't defend Ms Weir work, but "Mark Weir" is just a name. I mean, I don't think he decide anything at Sony, even if he might have a "voice" at the Sony DSRL headquarters. I had the chance to speak with some people at KonikaMinolta years ago and the impression I had is that Japanese companies take their decisions without giving that much importance to what "branches" think about -we expect they will take special care to the North American and or European market because we think they sell more cameras here, but I think they pay much more attention at what's happening in Asia, and specially now that people in China start having enough money for buy this kind of equipment.

I spoke, by chance. with Mark Weir at the Photo Plus Expo last year. I found he was in a difficult position because he knew the weakest points of the Alpha cameras, specially the A900 -He was defending some decisions engineers and designers made in Japan for the A900, talking about in a distant way, like: "the designer's team decided this was the appropriated way..." I think he's doing his job, but some people have a different point of view, I hope we will see soon the results.
Regards

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The A200 is not a big camera, but it's not a really small one either. If it were smaller I would not have bought it. The G1 is a different concept, and judging on the sales so far, it was not the camera to rise to the top of the DSLR sales..it was not the camera that showed us the mass market was mad about EVF either. Ditto E-420, I bet most sales come of the blowout priced deals. Small isn't selling as well as many think.

Doing "a job" and doing a "good job" are two separate issues. I think sony have massive untapped potential, and they are going pretty well, but still some silly things get through,things that never should have seen the light of day. Someone has to carry the can for that.

There is no way the Bionz raw design choice should have ever reached a production model, I believe it seriously damaged sales of that camera. All because Sony failed to understand what photographers want, and they don't want cooked raw. (ok they fixed it, nice..but don't do it in the ist place!)
I never understood the logic behind 2 live view models, makes no sense to me
Never really understood why the A200-350 series had expensive grips.
I don't think sony really understand image processing as well as their rivals, their love of chroma noise is not shared by photographers!
I see a place for an A500, but nothing has arrived
I believe that their new flash system is too crippled and shuts out lower end users from full functionality, a major mistake IMO.
Don't know why they chose a substance for the A700 grip sensors banned/restricted in most countries.

But no I don't hate sony, but as a user, I find the situations puzzling, and frustrating to a point, and worse..lacking logic and common sense (sometimes)
Sony are not doing a lousy job, if they were..it would have been bye bye, but the errors keep happening. Silly and obvious mistakes, that most users would not entertain at all, so who makes these choices?

The worst part, is I don't think Sony really listen to users (and I mean overall, not just me!) Nobody was asking for a 30mm macro DT lens, few see the point of a 50mm DT (35mm DT maybe) The in lens motors are not a bad idea, great..but doing the same kit lens as everyone else, just makes me thing Sony want to copy cat, rather than do their own thing. And nobody was complaining about the grips on the A200-350 either..all the needed to do was increase the distance from the grip to the moulded plastic around the mount. Sony are fixing and changing stuff, offering stuff, that few are asking for. I see them unfortunately as a company that just "thinks it knows best", right or wrong. The comments on the sony blog go unanswered, making you wonder why they even bother in the ist place. Strange...

It's not though. They chose it because it's the best thing to use for the application the next ones will be Cobalt (betting) no regulations there but it's just as toxic as nickel! and won;t last as long . this first hit Sony in the cell phone division. the problem is the regulation isn't written very well. there isn't a definition for "prolonged skin exposure" it probably should have been written as "prolonged subcutaneous exposure" with a definition of what prolonged is or they should have said Use only Gold if metal is required subcutaneously. in the US it's an FDA regulation (like is should be) and is one of the main reasons IV's are plastic now because the metal part is removed after insertion. Needles are stainless steel. witch is an alloy of (NiCr) Nickel Chrome! so the ban really is junk law.

Don't know why they chose a substance for the A700 grip sensors banned/restricted in most countries.

That law always was a total waste of space, what about wrist watches, how many stainless watches are worn on peoples wrists? I've had a Seiko stainless (watch and band) for more than 20 years myself, (and I just bought a Casio one today that's got a stainless backplate, it's even stamped on it "stainless") and that part of my wrist/arm shows absolutely no ill efects whatsoever after all those years.
Greg