Future of A mount

Specifically for the discussion of the A-mount DSLR range
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Fotogeorge
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Re: Future of A mount

Unread post by Fotogeorge »

bfitzgerald wrote: Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:17 pm Not sure if this helps but the only good third party cell I've used is the 2-Power NP400
I bought it from Duracell direct years ago, it's working like a champ and easily as good as the originals. Still going strong
I tried many others Patona (didn't last long) and some from China/eBay again they just went bad after a year or so. This one is still working great.
Maybe you can find one in the USA very good quality cell. I might buy another it's the best so far

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Yes the ability to use AA batteries I like (one thing I liked about Nikon) you could just load up the AA cartridge with 6 AA's and keep it spare, drop it into the grip when needed. Sony have never offered that, whist I have a lot of their batteries down the road I'm not sure how long you'll be able to get them. Can't even get replacement hoods for most lenses, Sony seem to have cut supplies off some time ago. Not a good sign
Thanks Barry: I found the 2-Power battery for 16.80 ibs, at duracelldirect.co.uk I don't know if they take USA money. They no doubt charge VAT.

I have three E-mount cameras. I like the A5100. Now, Sony is using the A5*** body for the new ZV camera. The prior ZV-1 had a fixed lens. The A5100 doesn't have an EVF. I use the Sony SEL 18-55, with the a5100. Now, they are inexpensive. It has steady shot, unobtrusive, and it's black. The black lens was hard to find. I like the small size of both the camera and the lens. I rarely do video. I turn off sound recording. I think there are too many laws in California that could put you into prison for offending someone, if you record their voices. You could get into jeopardy offending anyone for anything. Some police are stupid about laws and the rights of just shooting stills. They could just first arrest you and confiscate the camera. Once, I was warned by a cop about the laws recording voices. Cops aren't lawyers. Lucky 4 me: my Minolta dash cam only records sounds inside the car.
KM7D, Sony A350, A580, A-700, A57, A65, A5100 , a6500 , & a7iii, plus a bunch of lenses.
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bfitzgerald
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Re: Future of A mount

Unread post by bfitzgerald »

Give the battery a try I get on well with it if you can get one shipped to you.

I'm not sure what Sony's strategy for APS-C E Mount is, it seems more "vlog" or consumer based v offering maybe a semi serious better handling body for sports/wildlife. Maybe that will work for them, but I can see frustration from users who for some time have expected something different. I can appreciate the compact size of the cameras, using the A6300 like the output and sensor, I can see people who want to do video/adapt lenses getting on with it. I just find it a bit tedious to use, it just isn't "fun". It's slightly awkward and doesn't feel to me that is was designed with comfort in mind. It's usable - but a million miles away from the "mind of Minolta". The FF bodies are a bit better, however with limited adapter support I've found I'm rapidly losing interest in both A mount and Sony.

Long term I don't see much legs for APS-C as a system to buy into. Not for a system and not on E or X mount, cost alone is not viable or appealing even with third party offerings.

I might end up back to SLR at some point, if I can shift some of this gear. I may keep a few things around to play with. It's not too likely I'd stick with Sony. For me I don't see any desire to try new things, and handling/design are very important for many users. I'm sure some will like them. If I go ground Zero on Sony, that will mean everything will go eventually. I may keep a film 7 couple of vintage lenses and the 5d's. Things could change, who knows. With such limited support for the LAEA5 that's enough to make me look around at other offerings - and I don't feel Sony put much effort into looking after A Mount users which makes it hard for me to want to put more money in their direction. Sad as it is at some point we have to accept Minolta have been gone for a while, and maybe it's time to move on.
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Re: Future of A mount

Unread post by classiccameras »

It would be great if some one bought A mount off Sony, and resurrected the Minolta name, with new models. In todays climate it would not happen. pipe dream I guess
APS-C are still the cameras Canikon sell most of plus the enormous lens range inc. 3rd party and not to mention a very large used market
A mount and Canikon are two different worlds, Canon are a tempting brand especially with the smaller M mount, although so far sadly lacking in lens choice, but EFS can be used with adapter which is bundled with the R5 kit. At least the R5 and M50 look, hold and handle like a shrunk DSLR as does the Nikon Z which I mentioned in an earlier post as very nice to hold and use
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bfitzgerald
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Re: Future of A mount

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Look on the bright side it could be worse, if you have a K3-iii, you might be suffering from overheating/battery drain problems/shutter shock (even with MLU), looks like the infamous Pentax QC issues are back again! If someone gave me a Pentax I'd instantly get rid of it - awful awful company, so maybe using older dated A mount gear isn't so bad after all :mrgreen:

BTW still waiting for that K-r firmware update Pentax support promised..wow guess that will never turn up! Only camera maker I've dealt with that bare face out and out lied. At least Sony isn't "that bad" lol. EOS M is a curious thing seems people buy them, yet nobody talks about them? I'd wager Canon won't do APS-C on RF mount that's my feeling.
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Re: Future of A mount

Unread post by classiccameras »

Were Pentax awful under Hoya? probably and obviously now Ricoh, The brand remains an enigma. Such a shame after their hay day with 35mm and super Takumer lenses, Many pro's of the time could be seen with Pentax cameras. Even the Met Police used Pentax 6x6 for SOCCO ( CSI ) work. I agree, looking at Pentax now makes Sony look less of am awkward company to deal with. Sony had many faults most of their own making but we got by and I'm sure we all had our favourite model

I think Canon had their toes in the water for some time with the M mount, but its now gathering pace slowly in sales. I must admit I bought an Ex demo M5 and its a pleasure to use, and a lot easier to navigate the menu than my old 650D which I still rate highly. I tried out my EF-S 18-55 STM via the supplied adaptor and it works a treat. There is a serious lack of lens choice for M mount but lots of 3rd party primes from Korea. I'm quite impressed with the EF-M 18-150 which looks useful for a variety of subjects.

My Panasonic GX7 is now going for commission sale at my local store. Being totally honest the GX7 is a superb camera but the facilities available are a mine field and most aimed at the movie makers, they were superfluous to requirement. I will soon be an Ex Micro 4/3 user. My Panny FZ330 Bridge stays, its too darn useful and so does the Sony A58 and Minolta lenses.
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bfitzgerald
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Re: Future of A mount

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It surprises me how many QC problems there have been on cameras over the years. I am partly of the view that KM's departure might have been hastened with the first black frame problem, all 7d's evidently had it and many 5d's (both of mine one fixed). I doubt they made any money off those cameras, and probably might have lost money with repairs etc. Might have tipped the balance in offloading the camera division? Perhaps DK has more knowledge on this. The bounce flash overexposure on the 5d was never resolved either (the Metz flash is a good workaround)

More about what you do about a problem v if there is a problem. With Pentax it was "do nothing and hope it goes away". Their solution was to wait for a firmware update that never arrived. That to me isn't customer support - and suggesting I buy a K5 (which also had the problem!) was pretty rich and frankly shows how crazy Pentax support were. I've no idea how they are these days, if those issues are sign of development on a camera for years I would be very wary of Pentax. They had issues with flapping mirrors, aperture motor failures, SDM lenses conking out. I would never entertain Pentax again due to that.

True that Nikon have had their share of problems, the D7000 AF disaster, D800 also had major problems, the D600 oil splat sensor, D750 with AF artifacts due to the AF array design. Canon bar the light leak seem to have been more reliable except the 24-105mm ribbon cable debacle was widely known as a problem (aperture goes crazy not a cheap fix either)

Sony were very slow, though I did get compensated for that - took a bit of arm twisting to get the message through. They have had problems too with control dial issues, shutter failures on the MILC is concerning, LCD's where the connection wears out dud screen (I don't articulate them much hence I've not had problems) The A99 I still quite like it, that error message has not appeared again at least not for a while. Not sure I could sell it and I do like the output. It's a tricky thing this camera stuff, perhaps A mount got less attention than it deserved. I tested out the 50mm F1.4 and it's leagues ahead of the Canon F1.4 wide open (the Canon isn't unusable but it's nowhere near as good). It's the lenses that appealed with A mount more than anything - some of them really are quite good. The 50mm aka SLR era the Minolta designed lens beats out the Canon/Nikon/Pentax ones hands down (not talking about the new super pricey ones the original ones)

Sony never really took advantage of the steadyshot potential, nor did reviewers really give them credit for it (perhaps the lens prices were not so good v the IS/VR Canikon ones). Interesting that both Canon and Nikon have gone with IS in body with mirrorless. As a company though I feel Sony are quite detached from their users, just in general. That's my vibe partly down to the A mount wrangling (some obvious blunders) that budget FF never did turn up, and a the loss of OVF cameras in 2010 is a shame.
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Re: Future of A mount

Unread post by classiccameras »

It seems with each new or updated DSLR Pentax brings out they load more and more gimmicks and gadgets to an already over loaded menu, plus the cameras are getting heavier, good case in Point is the K7. Even my local Pentax dealer struggles to demo the menu

Early Minolta ( Rokkor ) glass was superb, later SLR lenses had the word Rokkor dropped. I would say having used both, the Canon FD glass was every bit as good. Minolta opted for a F 1.7 standard 50 mm kit lens I suppose to steal an advantage over most other manufacturers standard kit lenses which were mostly F 1.8.
I have a Minolta post Rokkor logo F 1.4 50 mm which is superb, Leica saw the quality of Minolta products and commissioned them to make a couple of lenses ( zooms ) for them plus the Lieca R4 with Copal square shutter was made by Minolta, this was in exchange by Leica for passing on the secret of how to make 'black' chrome to Minolta. My Rollei SL35 had Zeiss glass, namely a 50 mm F/1.8 Zeiss Sonnar, which in some respects was better than many Jap lenses,

Good point about Sony being detached from from its users, there never seemed to be any promotional back up, no matter how much money you spent on Sony kit. To Sony their photographic equipment was just another product in the long line of products they launched onto the market, no different than TV or Audio/sound systems not to mention the recording business in the music game. it was part of the companies strategy to have as many products on the market, Cameras were almost like a part time hobby to them, that's how big the company is, only Panasonic challenges their diversity. Would FF budget or not appeal to many photographers now that Micro is in full swing.

Like it or not we are going to be stuck with E and FE mounts in the future, and that seems to be Sony's photographic direction. If you are using A mount, no need to stop using it, they are not all going to conk out the day after the last A mount is sold.

Interestingly, on several camera versus camera compare sites, many Canon and Nikon's scored less than their equivalent Sony cameras, Even the budget A58 beat the Canon 650d and Olympus OMD - EM10 2 and 3, There are more.
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bfitzgerald
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Re: Future of A mount

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A friend of mine said about Sony once "I can't warm to a company that doesn't even say thanks for buying our products in their user manuals". I did check and amazingly I've never seen that printed ever on a Sony product/user guide - unless I missed something!
FF budget can appeal I know plenty of people who adapted a cheap A7 for oldie lenses - never bought a single Sony lens just the body. A mount would have had more appeal with a budget A99, make it plastic, single slot 4fps and way cheaper - might have brought a lot more people into A mount. Even now A900's are not cheap, way overpriced for their age so I passed on those.
I'd be surprised if L mount gets traction enough for full frame - seems way too late to the party who knows Panasonic have money and Sigma have lenses?

The F1.7 was a small but nice touch, going from F1.4 to F1/7 is half a stop - less dramatic than the 2/3 stop drop to F1.8. If that matters in an age of good sensors perhaps it doesn't, you can hit ISO 3200/6400 and in some cases on full frame higher and get usable results. Unthinkable in ye 35mm film days where perhaps fast lenses mattered more.

Pentax have tended to go for feature overload, maybe some of it is useful (astrotracer?). I did like their customisation, which to my eyes was always much more comprehensive than Sony. Nikon are too, again some of it is useful you can even tweak the metering size on CW, of course some bits are gimmicky. I don't see things changing much for Pentax over time, if they ever do a K1 III price will be through the roof! Good luck to the die hard Pentax users who stick around, something I wouldn't do.

BTW the offloading some A mount gear is erm rather slow, I might end up stuck in A mount unless some of it moves. I did check trade in prices on MBP, some are acceptable (for the bodies), I'm not trading in a Tokina 11-16mm as new for the rather pathetic €135 they offered in a quote! I can't afford to drop a €500 cost new lens almost for that! Most of the Sony lenses are not worth much on trade in 18-135mm doesn't even get 100 euro. Question is for A Mount users wanting to move away, can you afford to? I'd take a pretty big hit and most of my money is tied up in the gear I have (and I have too much)
The cheaper older Minolta stuff can be bundled with a film body to offload, they are not worth very much the oldie stuff. They do have charm though. I see people struggling to offload 70-400mm G's for under 700 euro, lens prices on A mount are not great if you are trying to sell. Body prices are up though

Unless of course Sony surprises us with a raft of firmware updates for the LAEA5 :mrgreen: So far it's looking like a "pay for feature" ie they want you to spend the money on higher cost bodies, that's not going to fly for me if I am stuck with A mount I'll just source used bodies if needed.
Last edited by bfitzgerald on Thu Jun 10, 2021 10:25 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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bakubo
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Re: Future of A mount

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classiccameras wrote: Thu Jun 10, 2021 2:26 pm Cameras were almost like a part time hobby to them, that's how big the company is, only Panasonic challenges their diversity.
Panasonic also makes toilets, bicycles, houses, rice cookers, cameras, sexbots, etc.. As for cameras, I own the Panasonic GX7II (GX85), G3, and TX1 (ZS100/TZ100) and like them all. I also own the Olympus PEN-F, E-M10II, E-M10, and E-M5 and like them all too. And about a dozen m4/3 lenses with a mixture of Olympus and Panasonic lenses. Both brands make some good stuff. But, Panasonic toilets, etc. are a whole 'nother world of benefit to humanity. We only used a Panasonic toilet in Sapporo for a month in 2014 (vacation rental), but it never gave us any problems! I bet it is still going strong!

2014: Panasonic benefits from cross-fertilization too

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54483986

I have read several times about how Olympus is supposed to have this wonderful synergy between their medical instruments and photographic divisions. A lot of cross-fertilization occurs so that both benefit. I think Panasonic doesn't talk about this sort of thing though so are they hiding their light under a bushel?

Here are photos of our toilet in Japan. As you can see clearly it is a Panasonic. Can you speculate on what kinds of synergy and cross-fertilization Panasonic and us customers benefit from between the toilet and photographic divisions?

Note to wags: Saying that the GX7 IBIS is [email protected] compared to the E-M1 IBIS is not fair. I would like to know what may be happening within the bowels of Panasonic that may result in better cameras...or maybe toilets, depending on which way most of the innovations flow. What can we flush out here?

Panasonic Crapper Stabilization for new toilets

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/56157638

The rumor here in Japan is that the synergy is getting into high gear now. The toilet division took the GX7 image stabilization and improved it for use in toilets! Here in Japan where earthquakes are common having unstabilized toilets is a big problem. Panasonic is about to upturn the whole toilet market with their new toilet with Crapper Stabilization (registered trademark). The crapper sits down and the earth movement sensors in the toilet will stabilize the crapper in case of earth movement! The great thing about this for photographers is that the new stabilization tech from the toilet division then got back to the camera division where some of it made its way into the GX8. Long live synergy!

The whole Pacific Rim (aka Ring of Fire) is prone to earthquakes so Panasonic expects to sell a sh!t load of toilets with Crapper Stabilization.

Panasonic bicycles:

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/54555564

Panasonic builds houses too:

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/64790710

It sounds to me like this first step heralds the Panasonic entry into the booming (and banging) sexbot market. Bang your blues away with a Panasonic!

Panasonic's cuddly robot helps chase away pandemic blues

https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Electr ... emic-blues

Toilets, bicycles, and homes too! Recently while out walking I learned that Panasonic builds houses too.

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Re: Future of A mount

Unread post by classiccameras »

Mitsubishi are just as diverse, from oil tankers to SUV's The Japanese always amaze me the number of products they produce under one label. I have a Panasonic microwave, plus an FZ330 Camera
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Re: Future of A mount

Unread post by classiccameras »

Any body have experience/views on what DSLR's are easiest to use, starting with the menu navigation/set up then ergonomics in the hand and using. My nomination goes to Sony A mount. May be also the worst in people's experience.
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Re: Future of A mount

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I think it's mixed on ergonomics I can see things I like or don't from all the makers. I never cared much for Canon's layout, then again using them more over time I got used to it. Ditto with Nikon their layout (on SLR's) is different again, using the top LCD and combination of front/rear, in a different way to Canon with their button approach - which I think Sony copied a bit with the top plate. Not exactly but similar aka drive/wb etc.

On the Sony A I think the grip is among the best I've used comfort and fit it's excellent shape and pleasure to use all day long. I do miss the more acute angle on the front dial, wish the dials were not rubber and stuck out a bit more. I'm also not a fan of the rubber on the sides going over the edges - seen some people wear right through them. They are mostly minor complaints - I still miss the Minolta dials - some appeared on the higher E mount bodies v wasting the empty space. Nikon/Pentax also use them to better effect

Goes back to the old DK argument about less dial and more buttons - which perhaps isn't the best way forward. I see Canon using the no mode dial on the R5, though they got closer to SLR shape then most others with Nikon behind them a little (still quite comfortable to hold tried a Z6)

One thing I don't get is with newer cameras they are putting a joystick on the back and a D pad 4 way selector/with built in dial. Yes you get a third dial, but it seems overkill I'm not sure you need both - it could be argued too much stuff going on there.

I don't really care much for Fuji having used a few, yes they copied the Minolta dials and plenty of them - yet most of the bodies have undersized grips. Ditto on Sony E - they seem stuck in a rut with their body shape/design and I'm not much of a fan. I have no interest in pretend retro or trying to pass a nod to older camera designs. It's not done for superior ergonomics, it's done for reasons I have no idea about. Likewise the built in flash is all but gone on many models - how this is a step forward I'm just baffled about. Plenty of times I've used a built in flash when needed, or as a basic trigger. Seems more like a cost saving measure then what users want/need. I could argue the GPS thing too ;-D Useful and many apps struggle to connect to a camera reliably.

Sony did reasonably well on ergos with A mount, with a few misfires (cough A230 etc). All that's been thrown out the window now - small is fine but you have to consider the end results. Canon also misfired a bit on the R5 grip button layout doesn't match the body. Plenty of mistakes though it seems Canikon will go more for SLR style bodies v Sony's blend of modern/retro. I know which I prefer!
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Re: Future of A mount

Unread post by classiccameras »

Yes, camera ergonomics and lay outs can vary quite a bit from one brand to another. Looking at menus and controls first but not too deeply
Most DSLR'S are now in the same ball park re body styling. Even the small Canikons stay in the same ball park

Menus were and are my big issue they can be either easy to fathom out or daunting and perhaps bewildering to some people, Case in point, Pentax has a menu system with so many customisable settings to basic settings it became a nightmare for me, I just could not get used to it. It had to go

Apart from Olympus M/4/3 body styling which I found to cramped, their menu system has always been in a several tier system, Finding useful bits of adjustment buried deep in the lower tiers was a pain. The quick menu was much more useful for basic adjustments

Panasonic although extremely over prescribed with customized settings mainly for video, the touch screen proved very good to reach your settings quite quickly for stills, I liked my GX7 for this reason, although body styling was a bit to compact but not as crazy as Sony E bodies which I did not like one bit.

Nikon D 3/5000 series menu took only a short space of time to get used to, but some of their button placements were illogical, one being all on its own down near the lens mount and impossible to reach while holding the camera.

Canon, now here we have a company who though they had designed a very logical menu system, but forgot to omit all the button presses you had to make before you reached the setting you wanted which was probably a much used setting anyway, Canon sent you round the houses to get there. However after owning a 650D and now a M5, both with touch screens finding things is much easier and you are fast tracked to your destination. I have got used to the Canon menu system now and although not perfect I can live with it.

I have no experience of Fuji except my old X10, but they seem to have adopted a retro styling with body and controls, I cannot comment except when I held a XT20 in the shop. Felt good, weighty for its size, and dials I could probably get used to, but I never did find out

Sony A mount SLT, here is a camera series streets ahead of the rest with body ergonomics, button placement, dials and ease of use. A logical easy to use menu that is not bewildering or the least bit daunting. Its a pleasure to use these cameras A 37/57/58 in my case, my only disappointment with Sony SLT was the lack of user control over noise filters at lower ISO settings and I thought cameras like Olympus and Canon had nicer colour rendition.

I cannot say much about the A6000 I had, only the menu was about the same as A mount SLT with a few extras, not great to hold and operate, not for me
Agree with you re the Joy stick and D pad and 4 way selector, a bit of over kill.
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bfitzgerald
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Re: Future of A mount

Unread post by bfitzgerald »

Well here we go again with another bash at the "retro" theme digital camera style from Nikon!
You even get a choice of colours anyone fancy the green or pink?
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Looks like a repackaged Z50 in an FM style body, can't see any other obvious difference apart from the flip out LCD. No sensor IS either, same sensor used in D500/D7500/Z50 etc
Maybe they're going for the hipster crowd?

More news Canon have a new "more affordable" RF 14-35mm F4
It's a mere $1700 what a steal! :roll:
Canon's pricing is shaping up to be close to outrageous for RF lenses. I bet they sell a lot of EF to RF adapters
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Re: Future of A mount

Unread post by classiccameras »

Everything in the camera/lens world is getting outrageous
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