A quick A380 18-55mm sample pic

[David Kilpatrick]

OK, I would be suffering serious buyer's remorse at £600 for what the camera is - there's no way it feels like the same £600 as the Canon 500D kit or the Nikon D5000 kit. Since the A380 probably feels exactly like the A230 really, and the A230 is lighter and smaller (cheaper) than the A200, it's a £600 purchase which feels like a £250 kit.

I should have a review up within a week anyway. First results are promising, the 18-55mm is certainly no worse than the 18-70mm (but nowhere near as good as the Nikkor 18-55mm VR). It's best at the long end, even wide open 55mm is impressive.

Here is a full 14 megapixel raw process ISO 200 shot at 55mm, f/8 (one stop down from wide open). Normal sharpening (25) in ACR but radius turned down to minimum 0.5 instead of the default, otherwise it was looking quite coarse and the fine detail like grass was not improved by that. No NR. No CA correction either, this lens is not perfectly sharp to the corners but it has about the lowest CA of any zoom (even a humble 18-55mm) I have used. The cricket whites would show CA straight away!



http://www.pbase.com/davidkilpatrick/image/115263489

for the full size file (JPEG 10 compression, it has lost a tiny bit of quality). Look at the batsman and the wicket keeper, and the teacher who is umpiring - I think the focus is nailed, and the level of detail every bit as good as you could expect from the kit lens. The grass of course is still typical Sony (or KM) not Canon-style, it has blades

David

[bfitzgerald]

Looks ok to me.

So it's not so amazing at the wide end then??

[David Kilpatrick]

Very soft corners at the wide end. Much more so than, say, the 16-105mm at 16mm wide open. The corners have a 'sudden death' loss of sharpness as if the image circle was meant for a slightly smaller sensor. They sharpen up really well by f8 though.

I thought this lens might perhaps be on the same level as the new 18-55 Nikkor, which is really exceptional, and it isn't - it's still a very cheap kit lens and the focusing is just as noisy and slow as the old 18-70mm screw drive, and the front bit wiggles around just the same, and the filter thread rotates when focusing, and the mount is plastic - etc etc.

David

[stevecim]

I would have thought that kit lenses could have been one of those area's where Sony could have gained a good rep.
They have both G and Zeiss at the high end, why not make a loss on kit lenses and sell the bodies with good quality kit lenses.

They need to sell cameras, If camera sales go up so will Zeiss/G sales go up.


When I brought my first SLR , Minolta 3xi, I went to 3 bigest camera stores in melbourne. looking for an entry level SLR. looked at Minolta/Canon/Nikon. At all 3 stores I was told by the sales staff. that the 3xi had more features than the entry level Can/Nik , and that the kit lenses on the minolta where much much better than those of Canon/Nikon. So I went Minolta. Now I don't know if that was true or if all 3 store just had stock of 3xi they wanted to off load. (Did Minolta make better kits lenses?)

I just don't see the point of sell AU$1000.00+ bodies with low quality kit lenses, how bad will the higher end a5xx, a850 look if they try to sell them with the same poor kit lenses?

[bfitzgerald]

I can live with the cheapo build, not a major problem. But disappointing about the performance unless stopped down. I feared we might get a gimmick SAM implementation, in fact I would say "what's the point" I thought the idea of an in body motor was to make things quiet..oh well.

Wonder how the review sites will rate it, seems they missed a chance to put a very decent kit lens out there. The Canon IS one is pretty good, tried that..and quiet too. Much improved over the old one (which was just plain not good, esp bad unless stopped right down, even then..not great)

[stevecim]

A380 are starting to show in Melbourne stores, had a play with one.
Street price in Melbourne is AUD$1690.00 for a380 twin lens kit, the current price on Nik D5000 twin VR kit lenses is AUD$1599.00 (after $200 cash back from Nikon) and the a330 twin kit is AUD$1450 odd .

Will be interesting to reads David's review. Things I don't like are.
* grip
* You need to go to the menu to change local focus points, Pressing the AF button only (when in local focus mode) allows you to change to the centre focus point, while it's pressed. but it does not allow to change the selected point. (which is the way the centre button works with the a350) To use a different local focus point you need to go to the menu. it takes 10 button presses to change from the top left focus point to the bottom right focus point and you have to look at the LCD to get it right. (I hope there is another way to change them)
* when in A/S/M modes, you need to go to the menu to enable flash, if you want to stop using the flash, back to the menu, "closing" the popup flash does not turn it off. I don't see how replacing the decicated flash release button to enable and close flash to disable with a mutli-press menu enable/disable makes it easier to use.

* Missing all the little buttons. AEL,ISO etc except for the "zoom" that buttom they could have dropped off. I can see what all the reviews will say. "Sony got rid off all the useful buttons and kept the one no one uses"

Things I liked.
*dual memory card slots

[bfitzgerald]

I wondered about the flash. I struggle to see how logical it is to remove the flash raise button, surely it's no "pro" feature!
Seriously having to dive into the menu for flash raise in some modes, would annoy the hell out of anyone.
I am still in shock, that a company that has a pretty solid entry level series (not perfect..but pretty good), could stuff things up purely on the basis of trying to pander to a specific group of buyers

When basic handling and functionality are sacrificed, you have to ask some questions about who is calling the shots here.

I'll post a film 5 out to sony and tell them to shoe horn a sensor in there That's how to do small easy to work and appealing to new and more experienced users.

[stevecim]

I can sort of understand what Sony are trying to do, but 1 low end model at the most 2, 1 with LV and 1 without. but 3 models just looks bad. The A230 could have been called a A130 and should had the 14MP sensor, and the A380 could have been called a A180, that way it's clear they are low end and both should have been priced well under AUD$800 .

With the A330 selling at mid $1400 and the A380 high $1600 the new A5XX are going to be closer to $2000.00 (higher that the A700)
The A500 had better be upgrades to the A700 or Sony will have replaced 4 well selling models with 4 new models that no one wants.

Even DPreview who don't like Sonys had this to say about the A350

Pros
* Good detail at lowest sensitivities, competitive with best in class
* Reliable metering
* JPEG output makes good use of the sensor's dynamic range
* Most seamless live view system of current DSLRs
* Probably the easiest DSLR to use for a compact camera user
* Super SteadyShot helps keep snaps sharp
* External ISO button
* Above-average ergonomics for its class
* Well-featured and usable software included
* Very good battery life
* Wireless flash capability
* Solid-feeling construction

Cons
* Soft JPEGs with poor low-contrast detail
* Smallest viewfinder to appear on an APS-C DSLR
* Screen obstructs use of viewfinder
* Image quality suffers above ISO 400 (from both noise and excessive noise reduction)
* Long exposure noise reduction turns hot pixels black
* Slower and less responsive than its contemporaries
* Poor continuous shooting rate
* Most convenient button on body given least useful function


the new model loose , * External ISO button, * Above-average ergonomics for its class * Very good battery life and * Solid-feeling construction With the Cons * the Screen is less obstructive of the viewfinder and I don't know what else has been improved gains Light weight and better menu, maybe better focus and AWB

[Javelin]

These cameras are almost exactly the same size and shape as the 5 actually dimension wise they are little bigger.

[David Kilpatrick]

Although the 18-55mm is poor at the wide angle end, I have been using it more, and it's OK when stopped down. From 35-55mm it's totally different - very clean. Also, it focuses closer (in repro ratio terms) than any other Sony lens. It will produce 0.34X scale images - the best tyou can get from any other lens in the system apart from macros is 0.29X. It is also very sharp at 55mm and minimum focus, and beats the Nikon 18-55mm VR lens with an additional 10% magnification/ratio.

It still feels really cheap and basic by comparison in the hand , though.

David

[stevecim]

I found this on Sony.com.au



gives a bit of an idea behind the design of the new bodies.

Looks like the whole point of the new control layout is to match their PnS.

A interesting test would be to hand one to someone that has only used a Sony Cyber-Shot (and never had a SLR)
and see how easy they operate the camera .

[bfitzgerald]

Just dropped into a Sony Centre in Cork, and they had an A230 there. Of course I had to have a quick grab, and the feel of the camera was every bit as bad as I anticipated. Obviously I knew I wouldn't like it, but holding one..well I cannot see many folks being happy with the grip and the feel of it.

I cannot comment on the optics of new kit lens, but again..sadly...SAM on this lens is not worth a can of beans, it's just as noisy as a screw drive. Seems our calls for in lens motors were not followed though in the way wanted (aka make them "quiet")

I got talking to the sales guy, and I conveyed my feelings about the new range. From what he said, they ain't exactly flying out the door either. I expect Sony to quietly drop this design next time round, and go back to something more normal.

They had A350's on sale there, and it was described as "a good seller" by the guy in the shop. I get the impression they are less than blown away with them as well

[bakubo]

I cannot comment on the optics of new kit lens, but again..sadly...SAM on this lens is not worth a can of beans, it's just as noisy as a screw drive. Seems our calls for in lens motors were not followed though in the way wanted (aka make them "quiet")

Two things come to mind:

1. Be careful of what you wish for, you might get it.

2. The Law of Unintended Consequences.



The same thing happened when so many people were complaining about A100 high ISO noise. Next camera was the A700 and then everyone complained about high ISO noise reduction.

I think we see the pattern. Sony hears complaints and is totally clueless about what they really mean so they come up with some brain-dead new design that doesn't really address the real problem.

[Greg Beetham]

Exactamundo Henry, somehow we ended up with that rotten Nikon style on/off switch around the shutter button on the new ones, and I don't think anyone even asked for that.
Some people have been agitating for a useless top panel LCD for a long time as well but Sony has been showing remarkable restraint in that regard...so far.
Greg

[KevinBarrett]

Gosh I hope we don't get another top panel LCD. I like having buttons and switches there instead, and what would be more useful would be more info in the viewfinder.